Russos em Fátima e Yazidis preocupados

Bispo Clemens Pickel, russófono

É dia 13, por isso é dia de Fátima. Neste momento está no santuário uma comunidade de católicos de língua russa. Um dos seus bispos sublinha a importância de Fátima para eles.

Temos também uma entrevista de João César das Neves, autor do livro “O Século de Fátima”.

Notícia de dois ex-funcionários do hospital Bambino Gesu, em Roma, que são acusados de desviar fundos e que serão julgados por isso no Vaticano.

Hoje publico a transcrição completa de mais uma das entrevistas que fiz para a série “E depois de Mossul?”. Neste caso trata-se de Mirza Dinnayi, um activista da comunidade Yazidi que fala sobre a posição deste povo num eventual braço-de-ferro entre curdos e árabes no Iraque.

Não deixem de ler o artigo desta semana do The Catholic Thing, sobre como a crença num sistema de valores objectivo implica acreditar em Deus.

ISIS destroyed the harmony of the society in Nineveh

This is a full transcript, in the original English, of my conversation with Yezidi activist Mirza Dinnayi. It was recorded on the 14^th of March and used for a series of articles published a few days before the liberation of Mosul.

Esta é uma transcrição completa, no inglês original, da minha conversa com o activista yazidi Mirza Dinnayi. Foi gravada no dia 14 de Março e usada para uma série de artigos publicados dias antes da libertação de Mossul.

When Mosul is liberated, we can expect the situation between Kurdistan and Baghdad to come to the surface. Do you believe that it could turn into an armed conflict?

There are many conflicts that can happen after the liberation of Mosul. One of them that you mentioned is the conflict between the KRG and the central government about the future of the disputed area.

But what we saw in the last weeks also, because of the Turkish factor and pressure from Turkey, was a conflict between PKK and KDP which is also a very dangerous conflict which is taking place in Sinjar area. Just today some PKK civilian sympathizers, Yezidi people, were demonstrating in Sinjar and a 16 year old was killed by Peshmerga forces from KDP and about 20 people were injured. Two weeks ago, or one week ago, there was also a conflict between Rojava militia, which is supported by Turkey and KDP and PKK forces, and there were also more than 20 injured and at least four people were killed.

So the problem is that we have, in these disputed areas, two types of conflict. One is between KRG and the central government, about the future administration of this region, and the second is an inter-Kurdish conflict, with influence of Turkey and Iran. Some Kurdish forces are supported by Turkey and others are supported by Iran and they are fighting each other. This is more dangerous than the conflict between Iraq and Kurdistan.

I have read reports on heavy presence of PKK militants in and around Sinjar, and that many of these are actually Yezidi members of PKK. Is it true that there is a big presence of Yezidis in PKK?

The sympathy is more directly to the YBS [Sinjar Protection Units] and YPG, more than being members, there are actually very few members, among Iraqi Yezidis there are no members of the PKK, but we have members of these YPG or YBS militias, which are also armed forces, but supported by the Iraqi Government, and they have some relations with the PKK, but they are not direct members of the PKK because PKK is a forbidden organization in Iraq and Turkey, but also in Europe.

So these are people who have some sympathy for PKK, and one of the reasons why they joined YPG or YBS is because they were the ones who, in 2014, liberated more than 150 thousand Yezidis from the Mountain when ISIS attacked the Yezidis. At that time the Peshmerga forces collapsed, the Iraqi forces collapsed, and these people came and saved the lives of tens of thousands of Yezidis who were surrounded in the mountain, without food or water. So this is one of the reasons some of the people in the area have some sympathies for these forces and joined them.

We also have armed force which belongs to the Iraqi Hash al-Shabi Forces [Popular Mobilization Forces] who are Yezidis from one side, and which also have some relations with YPG or YBS. The problem is that KDP said that Sinjar should belong to them, and the Peshmerga say that these groups do not belong to the Peshmerga and they are not legal groups, so they should leave. But the problem is that these people are from Sinjar, not from outside. This is a problem that we have and we have tried to solve this conflict in a peaceful way, but unfortunately it has not been possible.

The Kurds seem set on independence. What is your position on this?

There is a wish for independence among the Kurdish people, we support this wish, but we think that these problems, especially in the disputed areas, because most of the Yezidi people and the minorities, Yezidi and Christian, in Iraq, are living in these disputed areas and we think the only way to declare independence is if it is peaceful, because a war will damage our community.

The Yezidis have some demands from Iraq and from Kurdistan, and our demands are to have some special autonomous areas, self-administered autonomous areas, for Yezidis, a province in Sinjar and Nineveh Plain, and these areas should be in cooperation between Bagdad and Kurdistan. This is the wish of the Yezidi people. Because there has been no referendum, we don't know what the people will decide, we think that it is the best way to find what the Yezidi people want. I think the Yezidis will agree, but not without conditions.

If Kurdistan does become independent, and an autonomous region for minorities were to be created, should it be linked to Bagdad or to Erbil?

After all the problems that we had, after the genocide, I think it is the full right of the Yezidis and the Christians to have some demands in order to be part of Kurdistan or not. This is the position of the Yezidis at the moment. Most of the Yezidis would like to be in Kurdistan, because we don't think that we have a future with Mosul, we think there is no future between Yezidis and Mosul, because all the attacks were planned in Mosul, Yezidis were sexually enslaved in Mosul by Sunni Arabs, so there is no way in the next generation to be integrated so smoothly with Mosul, but with the Kurds we have the same roots, we have ethnical roots, so it could be. But we have to have a democratic background and to save the lives and the future of Yezidi existence, their political and social entity, I don't think the Yezidis will agree without conditions.

When you speak of an autonomous region, you would be living side by side with other minorities, such as Christians, Shabaks, Turkmen, etc. Is this what the Yezidis want as well?

Yes, this is the idea, that all the minorities live together in peace.

The Kurds reserve places in their parliament for ethnic minorities, but this does not include Yezidis. They say Yezidis are Kurds with a different religion. What is your opinion on this?

The Yezidis are not united about this issue. Some of them say we are an independent nation, some say we are Kurds, and some say we are an ethno-religious entity and that this ethno-religious entity should be respected. So we have three versions, and my opinion is that the identity of the Yezidis has been established now as an identity after genocide, so the feeling of the Yezidis before and after 2014 is different. The politicians in Iraq and Kurdistan didn't realize this until now, unfortunately, but they should recognize it.

Christians seem very divided in this region, with more than a dozen political parties and at least six militias. The Kurds are also quite divided, although all seem to agree on independence. Does this problem affect the Yezidis as well?

Unfortunately yes.

The community is divided because of the genocide and the massacres, and the genocide has not stopped yet. So my community is also divided in membership among different parties. We have Yezidis who belong to the PKK, Yezidis who belong to the KDP, PUK, independent Yezidis, some small Yezidi parties which were useless in the last two years. Now the elections will come and there will be new political identities of Yezidis, so I think my community is also very divided, maybe not as badly as our Christian brothers, but also divided.

I see you used the term Christian brothers. If there is this autonomous region you would be living as brothers with the Christians, Shabaks, Turkmen... Are relations between Yezidis and Christians and these other minorities brotherly, would it be easy to live in this autonomous region in peace?

I think that between Yezidis and Christians there is no problem. With the Shabak Shias we have no problem. The Shabak Sunnis, unfortunately, joined ISIS. The Shabak themselves are divided. And for Turkmen it is also very difficult because we have Turkmen Shias and Turkmen Sunnis and these aggressively joined ISIS, and they were members and they attacked Yezidis, but we have very good relations with the Turkmen Shia, so you will find that the minorities are even divided among themselves and that ISIS destroyed the harmony of the societies, but in my opinion Yezidi, Christians, Shabak Shias and Turkmen Shia can understand each other. Any relationship with Sunni Muslims, because of ISIS, cannot be included in such projects, in my opinion.

For the creation of an autonomous region you would need support and allies. Bagdad and/or Erbil, but also international allies. Do you have allies for this plan at the moment?

Unfortunately we are trying to lobby at the European Union level and at the American level. Everybody, from the UN or different Western countries, they tell us that we are right, that we need an autonomous area, but everybody is asking us who will pay for it. And this is a problem which we have now. We have some solidarity from the Western countries, but nobody is ready, until now to establish a project... I think the international community as a whole is responsible for this.

As duas escolhas dos yazidis

Yazidis durante o cerco ao monte Sinjar, em Agosto

Espero que todos (pelo menos os cristãos) tenham tido um Santo Natal!

Foi com agrado que vi que os cristãos e demais refugiados no Iraque e na Síria foram recordados este Natal por muita gente, desde clérigos a artistas.

Mas os cristãos não são os únicos a serem perseguidos no Iraque. Neste tipo de tragédias é difícil comparar sofrimentos, mas a verdade é que os yazidi foram perseguidos com particular dureza. Nesta entrevista Mirza Dinnayi explica porquê. Podem ver a transcrição completa, no inglês original, aqui.

Um jovem muçulmano foi condenado à morte por apostasia, na Mauritânia, expondo a deriva fundamentalista daquele país.

O turco que tentou matar o Papa João Paulo II foi depositar flores no seu túmulo, esta semana, tendo sido deportado logo de seguida…

A comunidade de Taizé vai passar o ano na capital do país mais ateu da Europa, a rezar.

Não deixem de ler o artigo da semana passada do The Catholic Thing, sobre o valordas histórias e testemunhos pessoais na transmissão da fé! Vale bem a pena.

"Christians were given three choices, Yazidis only two: 'Convert or die'"

This is a full transcript of my interview with Mirza Dinnayi, advisor for the Kurdish Regional Government and Yazidi activist, who spends his time between Iraq and Germany. The news report, in Portuguese, is here.

Transcrição integral da minha entrevista a Mirza Dinnayi, conselheiro do Governo Regional Curdo e activista pela causa dos yazidi, que passa o seu tempo entre o Iraque e a Alemanha. A reportagem pode ser lida aqui.

Who are the yazidis?

The Yazidis are an ancient religion, about 5000 years old, they are about 500,000 in Iraq and outside of Iraq there are communities in Turkey, Syria, Armenia, Georgia and also a big community in Germany and other countries. Altogether there are about 1 million, half of them are in Iraq. The biggest community is from the Sinjar region – where there are about 320.000 – which was attacked by ISIS.

Because the Yazidi religion is one of the oldest monotheistic religions, believing in one God, although different from Islam and Christianity, they were attacked by Islamic State, which killed more than 3000, kidnapped more than 5000 and raped and enslaved thousands of girls and women. They they say the Yazidis are infidels, in the eyes of the Islamic State, because they are not mentioned in the Koran, which is why they kill them. Now we have more than 400,000 who escaped from their houses from Sinjar and the other areas of the Ninevah plains which are now under the control of ISIS.

What has happened to the communities which had to flee, did they all find refuge with the Kurds?

Yes, we have 400,000 Yazidi refugees in Kurdistan.

What conditions are they living in?

The conditions are very bad, because most of the tents in these camps are very simple tents, which are not prepared for the Winter or the cold. Also the tents which were distributed by UNHCR are not fireproof, they burn in 45 seconds, they are made of nylon so with a simple fire they are gone in 45 seconds.

Every week there are fire accidents in the tents, there are health problems. They are living in a very bad situation, there are no economic perspectives for the people, the people have no resources, no houses, and the local and Iraqi government cannot help them because they are too many. The international organizations are not enough because the situation is very bad and they cannot fill all the needs.

We are talking in general about refugees, but of course many of these people are your friends and family…

Yes, of course. My own town of 35 thousand people, all of them escaped and all of them are living in these tents.

Yazidis being evacuated from Sinjar

Did the fact that they were persecuted bring the Christians and the Yazidis closer together?

The Yazidi and Christian communities are still friends. In this situation they have the same problem with ISIS, with one difference; the Christians were not immediately attacked. During the occupation of Mosul they were given three choices, to convert, flee or pay a tax, the Yazidis were only given two choices: convert or be killed.

Also, ISIS did not take hostages from the Christian population, because they say the Christian religion is mentioned in the Koran, so they can be treated a little bit better than the Yazidis. But both Christians and Yazidis are suffering very much at the hands of ISIS.

What solution do you think is possible for minorities in Iraq? Do you defend the creation of a safe haven, as some defend, or do you believe that these minorities should have their own defence forces?

I think the international community is now responsible for finding a solution for these minorities in Iraq and there are two solutions which should be done, one of them at least. The first is to establish an autonomous region with international support and international peacekeeping forces support in this area of Sinjar and Nineveh plains, or otherwise to help these people leave Islamic countries, because we don't know what will happen in the coming years. We don't know if a new Islamic group will be established. ISIS had roots in Al-Qaeda and Al-Qaeda had roots in Iraq...

Every day there is another radical Islamist group and if there is no solution for this area, to protect these people and to establish peace in this country, it will be impossible to remain.

It is very difficult, most of the people there are helpless and the international community has unfortunately been silent and has not supported these minorities in Iraq.

We know that some Yazidis have chosen to remain in Sinjar mountain and some have taken up arms to defend themselves. Why have they decided to remain in this mountain, where they are more exposed to the Islamic State?*

In the mountain we have some religious heritage, some Yazidi temples. We have some fighters, because they are sure that nobody will help them, the situation of the IDPs in Kurdistan is already very bad so they decided to stay.

We have about 8000 people, some of them are fighters. We have 1250 families, or more, there. They decided to stay because they have no perspectives in Kurdistan or outside. They think it is better to die there than to be refugees in a camp, in a tent, without perspectives, without anything.

Every Yazidi is now waiting to know what the international community ca do for them. Will they support us politically? But until now it has not happened, unfortunately.

Do you believe the Islamic State can be defeated, and how?

What has been done against the Islamic State until now has been very week. We cannot win the war against the Islamic State with only airstrikes. We need forces on the ground, not only from the international community, we need them also from the Sunni world, they should fight ISIS, they should stand against the Islamic State because it was established with a background of Islamic Religion. Now it is the responsibility of the Islamic world, especially the Sunnis, to define themselves, they work against ISIS and the fundamentalist Islam. This is their responsibility, to fight, not only through air raids, but on the ground. We need forces on the ground, otherwise it is not possible to fight ISIS.

ISIS was able to flourish because of widespread discontent among the Sunni population. Do you foresee a future in which Sunnis and Shia can live in peace in Iraq?

I am pessimistic. I don't think that the Sunni and Shia will be together in a closed centralized country. I think the best solution is for them to establish a federal system, governed by moderate people, not radicals, who can serve their population and represent them.

The problem now in Iraq is that most of the Sunni politicians are not representing their communities, the ones in Baghdad, most of them are corrupt, they are working in the Government for their own profits, for their own benefits, and therefore they cannot represent their community.

The people don't know who represents the Sunni community in Iraq, we don't know. Is it ISIS? A radical group? The Ba’ath party remnants? Or the politicians sitting in parliament? We don't know.

Most of the Sunni regions are outside of the control of the Iraqi government, outside of the control of Sunni politicians, and therefore they cannot represent their communities. They should choose Sunni politicians who are not criminals, who are not ISIS supporters, who are not Al-Qaeda supporters, who can serve their citizens and serve the country. This is the problem we have now in Iraq.

Yazidis no monte Sinjar, cercados pelo Estado Islâmico

They have also taken in thousands of refugees, do the minorities feel gratitude towards the Kurds? How are relations between them?

The Kurdish government are doing what they can to support these IDPs and refugees. I think the situation now is that there is no conflict between the Yazidis, or the Christians, and the Kurds.

You can imagine if you have a country with a population of 5 million people and you send them two million refugees, it is a catastrophe. They cannot manage the problem. We know this. But as I said the best solution for these minorities, the Yazidis, the Christians and the Shabak is to establish a type of autonomous area for them. This solution should be implemented with the cooperation of the Iraqi government. 

Kurds are, mostly, Sunni. Is there also danger of radical Islam taking hold among the Kurds?

Yes, of course. We, the members of the minorities are afraid of radical people in Kurdistan. We are happy that the Government is secular, but in the community there are radicals and the Government should speak out against them.

It may be a small number, but over the last 20 years there was a type of islamization of the street, and this led to big problems, so that whereas the Kurdish people in the past were not very religious, there are now some religious people in the community.

There are some Kurds from the KRG who joined ISIS, a small amount, I don't know the number, maybe 300 or 500 fighters, more or less. There is fundamentalism in Kurdistan and we are trying to fight it, to become a liberal community in Kurdistan. We hope for this and we are working towards it, all of us.

What is your opinion on Turkey in the midst of all this?

The negative role of Turkey in support of the Islamic State is well known. Everybody knows that at the beginning Turkey played a very negative role in support of the Islamic groups, especially Jhabat al-Nusra, and other Islamic groups against Bashar al-Assad.

So now we have this problem: Turkey is under a big question mark, will it cooperate with the international community, first to stop the resources of ISIS and to stay in a positive situation? Until now its role has not been positive. Turkey cannot say "I will be independent about the issue of ISIS", because Turkey played a negative role and now they should change their policies and be positive, rather than negative.

Yazidi refugees in Erbil

All this instability has its roots in the Syrian civil war. Is there an end in sight?

They should find an outcome for the situation in Syria, peace should be established between all groups, with all opposition groups and non-opposition groups, otherwise we will have a massacre against the Alawites, for example.

All the Syrian players should work together, without Assad in power, but the Alawites should participate in planning the new country in a democratic way.

*Since this interview was conducted, the siege of Sinjar has been broken by Kurdish forces.